“From what I’m hearing, it’s never been this bad.”
What is it like to be living in Gaza right now?
For most citizens of America, this question might feel impossible to answer, or even to begin to imagine. For that reason, it’s essential to platform the voices who can provide specificity and color to that experience.
Basim Elkarra is the executive director of The Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR), a nonprofit and America’s largest Islamic civil liberties group. Below is a condensed conversation from an interview Katie recently conducted with Elkarra, in which Elkarra, a Palestinian himself, talks about how his family in Gaza is faring at this moment, and why conditions have “never been this bad.”
Katie Couric: I understand you’ve already lost three family members from Israel’s retaliatory attacks. Is that true?
Basim Elkarra: Yeah, I lost a cousin and his two children. The only reason the rest of my family has survived so far is that they’re splitting up the family. For example, a father will stay at home with his kids, while the mother will stay at her parents’ house. But that’s hard to do for a long time, and eventually, you see multiple generations of one family under one roof. There’s no place to go. There are no bomb shelters.
So it’s just horrific. Every day my family in the United States tries to check up on as many relatives in Gaza as possible. These relatives are trying to stay strong for the children, but they’re breaking. Some haven’t slept for days. One of our relatives was saying a day or so ago that there was a single 10-minute period without bombing, and everyone talked about how nice that break was. They were able to relax for 10 whole minutes.
When you first heard about Hamas’ attack, what was your reaction to the news?
Everyone’s in shock. Palestinians have made it clear that any attack on civilians is never justified. And also Palestinians living in the Gaza Strip know that any attack on Israel will lead to a greater attack on them. And so we felt that it was going to get very bad and very ugly, very quickly.
What is the general sentiment toward Hamas in Gaza? I’ve looked at various polls, and some have said up to 58 percent of the population supports Hamas, which I found surprising.
It’s been 30 years since the Oslo Accords, and we’re nowhere near closer to achieving peace. So some Palestinians have started to say, “OK, maybe Hamas is right.” It’s like Democrats versus Republicans in the United States. You have folks that support Hamas, and you have folks that support Fatah. That doesn’t mean they support everything from both sides — but what we often say is that there would be no Hamas if there was no [Israeli] occupation.
I think the majority of Palestinians support the goal of ending this occupation. Beyond that, it’s not a black-and-white thing. You have many folks who might support the policies of both parties.
How did the people of Gaza feel about Hamas’ attack on Israel, then?
If Hamas had only attacked the Israeli military, that would’ve been one thing. Remember, this is the military that has, for 75 years, occupied Gaza, put Palestinians in a stranglehold, controlling their water, their electricity, their gas, and so on. Prior to this attack, Palestinians who lived in Gaza would say, “They’re just killing us slowly. We’re dying slowly.”
These are folks who have never been able to leave Gaza because of this occupation. Imagine a city like Sacramento, where folks are not once in their lives allowed to leave, and every day the power cuts in and out, and citizens don’t even have access to clean drinking water on a regular basis. So if these folks saw their oppressor get hit, would some percentage of the population support that? Absolutely.
But killing civilians is a different matter. It’s against the Islamic faith to target civilians. So no one is going to justify that.
Tell me about what you understand is going on in Gaza right now. I know there’s great concern about starvation, and the United Nations has warned that this could have devastating humanitarian consequences.
Our relatives have told us they’ve run out of water. They’re just eating bread, and they’re trying to ration all of their food to make sure that the children have enough to eat. But some folks haven’t had water in days, and it’s dire.
From what I’m hearing, it’s never been this bad. That’s really saying something, too, because there have been many wars for these people. For some teenagers, this is the fourth war they’re living through. And even with all that trauma, our family has said this is definitely the worst one ever, mostly because the bombing is everywhere, and it’s relentless. And they’re predicting that it’s going to get a lot worse because unfortunately, the Western world has given Israel carte blanche to decimate Gaza.
Cycles of violence don’t make Israelis safer, and they don’t make Palestinians safer. And so we have to make a decision in the United States: are we going to support peace? Are we going to end the occupation and give everyone in this region freedom, dignity, and justice? Or are we just going to manage the occupation?
Why won’t Hamas return the Israeli hostages that they’ve abducted and brought to Gaza?
I can’t speak on behalf of Hamas, but Palestinians are saying that this was Hamas’ only way of getting the thousands of Palestinian prisoners released from Israeli prisons. The recent reports coming out of those Israeli prisons were horrific.
There has to be a solution to free the 5,200 political prisoners languishing in Israeli jails, not to mention the many children who are getting arrested on a daily basis. And if you don’t want to listen to the Palestinians, you can listen to what the Israeli officials are saying. Earlier this year, an Israeli Defense Force (IDF) spokesperson warned that increasing settler violence would likely increase the chances of Palestinian terrorism.
When it comes to a ground invasion, is it even possible for Israeli forces to eradicate Hamas?
The Israeli government knows that these attacks on Gaza actually just make Hamas stronger. They know they’re not going to eradicate Hamas. And for those wondering why Israel chose to attack Gaza in spite of this, keep in mind that Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has actually gone on the record regarding his interest in strengthening Hamas because that will destroy any chance of a two-state solution.
So this has been a deliberate policy by the Israelis over the years. They know there’s no eradicating any Palestinian group, including Hamas when these types of attacks and wars tend to unite people more than ever. And it’s having the intended effect that Netanyahu and his right-wing supporters want.
